Home > All, Conversations, Essential, Paranormal, Science, Skepticism > Conversations With A “True Believer” [Part I]

Conversations With A “True Believer” [Part I]

I think the majority of people who read what I write are pretty well aware of the fact that there is no scientific evidence for paranormal activity. None whatsoever.

With that being said, I’d like to present you with a series of email exchanges I’ve had with someone who I’d classify as being a “True Believer.” Someone who believes something regardless of the evidence to the contrary.

I’d received the first email from the person in question around the end of December of 2007 (12/18/2007). She had apparently been reading a few of my entries concerning ghosts and other paranormal phenomenon.

When paranormal activities occur you can’t say science doesn’t permit it. It’s obviously that is it something that the human mind does not have knowledge of, nor can we understand how it is possible. I have seen objects manifest before me and crash down to the ground, with 5 other people in a closed room and we all saw it. We can’t all be crazy. This happens daily in a house that I have investigated and is still happening to this day. I have it on my voice recorder, but did not have a video going at the time. There are sciences and afterlife that we just don’t know about. 100 years ago we probably would think computers were not possible. But as we learn and understand.. it’s not impossible.

I just wish we could find a way to get rid of this spirit or demon. We have tried everything. It is physically harming this family.

Before supplying you with my response, I’d just like to point out the logical problems with this email. The main problem is that this person is arguing from ignorance. There are things that happen which we cannot “understand how it is possible.” Because we don’t understand it, then this means that it is paranormal? This doesn’t make logical sense.

Here’s my response:

Hello,

Thanks for taking the time to write to me.

I just wanted to clear a few things up about what you suppose my thoughts are on “paranormal activity.” (I’m also assuming you’ve gotten these impressions from what you’ve read on my blog; godkillzyou.wordpress.com.)

First of all, I’ve never said that science “does not permit” paranormal activity. Any time I’ve written about ESP, Ghosts, or anything Paranormal, I’ve always said that there is no scientific evidence of it. If there were, than I’d be more than happy to accept it as truth that these things do, in fact, exist.

Think of it this way. If what you’re saying is true, then humans couldn’t rely on anything. No laws of physics, no science whatsoever. What good is a law of Gravity if a ghost can make things rise into the air? Randomly? There would be no way of constructing a reliable experiment of any kind. “A ghost messed with the results.” It’s like saying the Flying Spaghetti Monster created the Universe, and He keeps us from finding out the truth because he modifies the results whenever we try to carbon date something. There’s no logic behind it.

If what you’re saying is true, and you have all of this evidence of ghostly activity, why then isn’t there a video camera running 24/7 in this house? A web cam? Wouldn’t you want to be the first person ever on Earth to prove that ghost do, in fact, exist? It just seems strange that whenever someone claims that they have ghost activity, there is never a video camera around. Only very questionable audio. Nothing reliable.

In terms of standards of proof, you wouldn’t take the type of evidence you’re offering from a pharmaceutical company. “The scientific community hasn’t actually studied this medicine, but 5 people we know said it works really well and you won’t die from taking it. Five people can’t be wrong.” I wouldn’t bet my life on that kind of proof.

As far as objects manifesting themselves out of nowhere, I find it very hard to believe. As, I think, it should be. How does one accept a statement like that when everything one knows about life contradicts everything that statement claims? It’s fundamentally a horrible idea to blindly accept anything (everything) you’re told. You’d end up believing that politicians told the truth.

As far as your analogy about computers, it isn’t really accurate in this situation. In fact, it speaks totally against what you’re trying to convince me of. Computers came about because of scientific study. Research and ideas based on a solid scientific foundation. Computers didn’t exist in some strange dimension in which we brought them out of by “detecting them,” or using strange devices to “prove they exist.” What you’re claiming goes against EVERY solid scientific idea known to man. You’re proposing something that goes against hundreds of years of solid scientific discovery. Scientific theories and laws that apply to every single possible situation in life… except when it comes to ghosts. There, as you seem to think, science has it all wrong. You saying that matter is spontaneously generating itself (manifesting, as you say). If that was true, we’d have our energy crisis solved. We could spontaneously manifest crude oil in this family’s house and pay $1.00 per gallon of gas again!

We know how matter and energy work. Objects are made of atoms. They reflect light and that’s how we see them. Atoms do not “manifest.” Newton’s law applies here. For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. For matter to spontaneously generate, it would, logically, spontaneously destruct/disappear/implode… whatever you want to call it. And the amount of energy required to create matter would be so tremendous that the Earth would no longer exist. Einstein’s equation E=MC^2 spells this out. Written in its original form, M=E/C^2 tells you, theoretically, the amount of energy required to create a mass. (I’m doing actual science here.) Suppose we wanted to create a glass plate that weighs, modestly, about 5 grams. This would require 449,377,589,368,408,820 joules of energy. Put another way, this is the amount of energy capable of accelerating 990,707,999,000,000,000 lbs of weight (495,353,999,500,000 tons!!!) at a speed of 1 meter per second, per second. This amount of energy “manifesting itself” in someone’s house would destroy the planet, and probably anything within a few light years of us.

I’m sure that you do sincerely believe what you’re telling me. But, when looked at under a scrutinizing light, nothing that you’re proposing makes any kind of sense. It’s easy to take something that is “yet to be explained” and claim that it is “unexplainable.” It just hasn’t been explained yet. Before lightning was explained, it was thought to be the work of “God,” the paranormal explanation. Now we know that static electricity causes lightning, through the discoveries of science.

My overall point is that science has been a tool for mankind for as long as man has been able to reason. Anything that has stood the test of scientific scrutiny has always been what human society has thrived on, because of its truth. Because it works! Anything that doesn’t stand up to the test of science falls by the way-side. Into the “paranormal,” or, as the word indicates, that which is not normal. Accepted. It is anomalous phenomenon. And anomalies are just that; anomalies. Things that are perceived as strange because of a lack of information. Science is the “normalizing” factor. If a proposition can’t stand up to accepted scientific knowledge, then we know that it can’t be true. There must be additional unknown information that needs to be discovered.

That’s the beauty of science. It isn’t set in stone. It’s only “accepted” if it works. If it doesn’t, then it changes. Our laws of physics are laws because they apply in every situation. And if someone claims something that goes against those laws, they have the burden of proof on their shoulders, because that one claim has to “out-prove” every bit of knowledge that has been acquired throughout human history. For you, your ghost activity has to “out-prove” pretty much every law of physics known to man. That’s a heavy burden. It would take a tremendous amount of documented proof before it would be accepted as reality. Remember, the same standard of proof as a pharmaceutical company. I’d have to trust my life with the evidence you provide.

Ok, so this ended up being a little long (-winded). But, I think you understand where I’m coming from now. Remember, I don’t rule out the possibility of the existence of ghosts. I just say that the probability that they do exist is infinitely small. Each day that there isn’t solid proof makes that probability even smaller. Just like every day that someone doesn’t find Bigfoot makes it even less likely that there is such a creature.

Thanks for writing.

David (AKA GodKillzYou)
No Special Qualifications
I Just Read Books And Study Reality
I Have Enhanced Looking Skills

A bit long-winded, but I feel that I got my point across. And yet, the next email continued with the same type of logical fallacies. Arguing from ignorance…

We have set up cameras in an investigation where the whole family had to move out for the night including 6 children. We cannot keep cameras going 24/7. The family has to live their lives and you wouldn’t believe how hard it is just to have an EVP session with the voice recorders. I never believed in a lot of this stuff, but regardless of what science is since the beginning of time….I think there is a lot of spiritual (don’t know if that is the right term) things that billions of people don’t have a clue about that is out there. You would have to be there, standing with a group of people and see a cup come from nowhere, like a flash of light, and just crash down on the floor smack in the middle of the five people who are talking about getting rid of this thing.

I used to watch shows on TV and think they were all made up for good TV, even when they said based on a true story, until now. I know what you are saying, it is impossible according to the laws of physics and years of scientific studies, but it happened.

Thanks for writing back. I am frustrated that I can’t figure this out…I am a private investigator.

It must be a pretty well-kept secret if billions of people don’t know about it. And that is part of the point I made in my final email reply.

I guess that is exactly what I don’t understand. If there is something out there, something that is solidly provable out there, how is it possible that, as you say, “billions of people” don’t know about it? It’s the same with Bigfoot and aliens and the like. For Bigfoot to even be alive, there has to be a sustainable population of them, in order for them to reproduce successfully. And yet, in a world of billions of people, not ONE of those people can provide even a single strand of concrete evidence that they exist.

Like I said, I don’t doubt that you believe what you saw, or that it was certainly compelling. I have a strong tendency to believe, though, that possibly you may have misinterpreted what you saw, or you were mislead. I don’t want to beat a dead horse, but our laws of physics govern everything, every action that takes place. Magicians like David Blaine and James Randi, as well as Penn & Teller are capable of mystifying feats. One might even question the reality of what they saw. But, as with what we know about the scam artist Uri Geller and his “spoon bending” fiasco, the human mind is easily deceived. All it takes is a little understanding of human psychology.

I think what might even be more appropriate in this situation is to design some experiments to prove that what you’re witnessing is NOT, in fact, ghost activity. That would fall more in line with the scientific method. It’s important to exhaust all options, every possible scenario before looking to the supernatural explanation. If it’s cups that are appearing in a room, remove all cups from the room, place them in a secure location, lock all the doors leaving only yourself and a few trusted colleagues in the room. Check for trap doors and lighting equipment that may be hidden in the ceiling or lighting fixtures. No one from the family should be in the room, as they may have some type of motive to convince you of this activity. Maybe they’re looking to make some money off a book or movie deal?

I would always question motive above anything. What can this person gain by trying to convince people that there are ghosts in a house? But, being a person with your qualifications, I’m sure you understand all of this. And I’m hoping you understand where I’m coming from.

Anyway, I appreciate your correspondence and I hope you had a Merry Christmas.

David

The most important thing thing when “investigating” paranormal phenomenon is to be truly scientific about what you’re doing. If you go into a situation looking to prove that ghosts do exist, then your investigation is already tainted. If you’ve got an emotional investment in the results, then you will, more than likely, slant the outcome.

Hi David:

I have a Merry Christmas as you I hope. I just want to say that you had to be there.

We had the room secured and I saw a flash come out of the wall up near the ceiling and as it hit the wooden floor and crashed the realization that it was one of her coffee cups that was in the dishwasher 30 minutes prior, 30 feet away and behind closed doors. Other things happened when I was there, but not in front of me. This was the convincing factor. I have EVP (Electronic Voice Phenomena) of more than one voice responding to my questions. The first thing we try to do is disprove it, but there are many recordings that we cannot debunk. These people DO NOT want anyone to know about this so I know they do not want a movie deal. They signed papers saying so. They just want help. There have been cups and glasses that manifested and crashed that were packed in newspaper in the basement and one that was packed in a box in the bedroom closet and they just come out of nowhere. One incident that I experienced was we were all talking and a bulb blew out in the chandelier in the foyer, so we thought, but I turned and looked immediately and saw a screwdriver falling from the chandelier and hitting the stone floor. I inspected the house when I went in and there were no screwdrivers in the living room which is where the screwdriver came from. The other side of the living room wall is the garage, but I didn’t think it was possible to come thru the wall, until I saw the cup manifest in the bedroom in front of me. I wish there was something else we could do to try to figure this out..but we are a small group with little equipment. Do you know of any scientist or universities that may be able to help us? What state are you in?

We also do this on a volunteer basis and don’t get paid so we have to do this when we all have the time and we aren’t working.

Thanks for all your advice. Let me know if you think of someone I can contact.

To Be (Possibly) Continued…

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  1. Monday March 17, 2008 at 5:35 PM

    Where was this person from? They could always contact CFI or get a hold of Ben Bradford or Joe Nickell.

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